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ed upon to vote for a bill to provide quainted with the character of the
precedent. What motive was there not come down here to take away for the House to interfere with more the salaries of some petty clerks, or jealousy now than in the former reign? to reduce the pensions of a few poor He appealed to the right honourable halt-pay officers, and shut my eyes to gentleman, whether, in his judgment this proceeding, by which such enor- and conscience, he thought, whatever mous sums are to be voted to his Ma- might be the views and characters of jesty without inquiry. I know I am public men, there ever was a period doing my duty; and if I am at all ac- in the history of the country when
they were so clear from taint and im- Pleas. The Admiralty of Ireland putation of a pecuniary kind. He consisted of a "judge, who had not begged leave to remind the House, been resident in that country for seven that supposing the beginning of a years, and was discharging his duty reign were a fit opportunity for com- by deputy. Then came a ninth class, mencing such an examination, there " barracks and board of works,” for was nothing to preclude it at any fu- which there was a charge of 33501. ture period when it might be thought This certainly formed one of the class. necessary : there were no instances of es in the original civil list arrangecommittees of this kind at the open, ment; but it then included the Lording of new reigns, but several in Lieutenant's and the Chief Secretary's their progress. He conscientiously house and gardens, which were not believed that it was the determina. intended to be comprised in this list, tion of the illustrious personage con- -and the expense of which, from cerned to live strictly within the li- 20,0002. to 30,0001., was made good mits prescribed by Parliament; and by votes of that House. There was, in asking for no more, he (Mr Can. in the class of state officers," a clause ning) did not think that any case had to which he decidedly objected—he been made out for jealousy on the meant the Lord-Lieutenant's addi. part of the House, or of discontent tional salary of 10,000l. per annum. on the part of the country.
In saying this, he did not intend to After a little further conversation, object to it with respect to the prea division took place, when Lord J. sent Lord-Lieutenant, because he had Russell's amendment was negatived accepted of the office under the proby a majority of 99: there being for visions of the act which had passed the motion, 157 ; against it, 156. The some years ago, for increasing the saoriginal resolutions were then agreed lary; he did however hope, that, when
a new Lord-Lieutenant was appointThe bill now proceeded in its dif- ed, care would be taken to omit this ferent stages through the House. On additional 10,0001. a-year. the 17th May, ministers moved, that These observations were supportthe blank amounts should be filled up ed by Mr Tierney, who repeated his with 850,0001. for the English civil objections against voting the English list, and with 207,0001. for the Irish. civil list without inquiry. Lord CasThis last sum drew forth observations tlereagh and Mr Charles Grant refrom Sir John Newport, who wished plied, that the minute specification for more information than was con- complained of was merely for the tained in the only paper on the sub- purpose of affording more full inforject laid before the House and which mation, and could be for no other be held in his hand. It comprised purpose. Lord C. held in his hand no less than thirteen classes, and he a much more detailed account, which, would call the attention of the House if called for, he was ready to produce. to it, as the most extraordinary clas. With regard to the salary of the Lord. sification of a civil list he had ever Lieutenant, it had been universally seen. In 1793, the courts of justice agreed that the former amount of formed one class; here they formed 20,0001. was insufficient to defray the four. The Court of Chancery was expenses of that high office; and it divided from the Exchequer, the Ex- was considered unjust that the perchequer from the King's-Bench, and son holding it should be obliged to the King's-Bench from the Common encroach on his private fortune. The
sum of 207,0001. had been carefully which might be considered national, examined by the committee of finance, and to confine the civil list to what andsinecures to the amount of 17,0001. should be actually fixed upon for the had been pointed out, which would permanent expenditure of the royal drop with the present holders, and fall family. into the consolidated fund.
Lord Liverpool observed, in reNo division was attempted on the ply, that the settlement of the civil subject, and the bill passed without op- list by a committee of inquiry was position through its remaining stages. altogether without precedent at the
This bill passed very tranquilly commencement of a reign; and their through the Lords, partly, no doubt, Lordships had at present an advanowing to the more urgent question tage never possessed on any former with which that august House was occasion, in consequence of the miforthwith occupied. In its prospect, nute investigation which had taken however, the Marquis of Lansdowne, place in 1816. If the noble marquis on the 5th May, inquired of Lord referred to that settlement, he would Liverpool, whether he intended to find that every thing had been done move the appointment of a committee with respect to simplification, that of inquiry. The minister replied, was practicable. In every step of the that he considered the accounts laid arrangement then made, the public before Parliament in 1816, as contain- advantage and interest had been maing information sufficient. Lord Lans- turely considered. The great object downe then urged, that at least the was, to take from the civil list and reprinting of these accounts was ne- transfer to the consolidated fund vacessary, and that other information rious payments for services of a pubmiglit be called for. Besides eco- lic nature which could be advantanomy, he considered the simplifica- geously separated. By this arrangetion of these accounts as an impor- ment much improvement in the actant object. He wished to render it counts had been accomplished: but clear what part of the civil list went it was proposed that other charges of to the maintenance of the royal fa- a fluctuating or uncertain nature, mily, and what was applicable to other should be voted annually, and thus purposes, or to services more strictly made subject to the control of Parlianational. Some approximation to this ment. Upon examination, it would, object had been made in 1816, and however, be found, that all the artihe approved of the arrangement then cles of this description were of a peadopted to the extent to which it culiar nature, to which such a check
But it had stopped short of could not with propriety be applied. the point of real utility, that of redu- The department most subject to fluccing the civil list to what might be tuation in its expenditure was the granted for the regular expenditure royal household, and its fluctuation of the royal family, and leaving out was owing to the same cause that proevery thing of a fluctuating nature, duced a variation in the expenses of and all those expenses which were any other family, namely, the differproperly national, subject at all times ence of prices. Now, as to separa. to the consideration of Parliament. ting the expenses of the royal family The most proper arrangement, he from all charges for the maintenance thought, would be to charge the con- of the civil government, in the mansolidated fund with every expense ner the noble marquis had proposed
that was an arrangement, of the pro- factures, of commerce, or of them all priety of which he entertained very-still any person who gave a moserious doubts. The spirit of the ment's thought to the subject must constitution required that the expen- perceive, at the bottom of all the evil diture of the crown should be con- which the country suffered, the dissidered as part of the expenditure of ordered state of our finances. He the country. It was doubtless on that might be told that the committee of ground that the charges for the civil finances had, for some years past, government had been joined to the taken our military expenditure into civil list, and he should therefore con- consideration. The military expensider any attempt to produce a total diture was, however, so extremely separation as at least extremely in- complicated, that it would require the discreet.
attention of a specific committee; and The accounts were ordered to be without meaning offence to the finance Teprinted, and no subsequent opposi- comunittee, he must be allowed to say tion was made to the bill in the Upper that their exertions had not been efHouse.
ficient-little good had emanated from This grand question being adjust them. No hopes of reduction, he ed, it remained only to go through conceived, could be entertained from the regular financial arrangements of ministers, whose interest lay in the exthe year. The first step consisted in tension, not the diminution of power the production of the estimates for and patronage. Of this a striking the different branches of expenditure. proof had been given in the late apOn the 17th May, Sir George War- pointment to the governorship of Gibrender produced the navy estimates, raltar. In the whole list of sinecures which, not differing materially from there was not one more decidedly those of the preceding year, exci- useless than the governorship of that ted little discussion. Previous, howe place. It stood almost alone amongst Efer to the production of the military sinecures ; so much so, that a Comestimates, a motion was made by Co- mittee of that House some years since lonel Davies, (May 16,) for an in- recommended that it should be aboquiry into this branch of expenditure. lished as soon as ever it fell in. Yet, He did not demand any definite re- scarcely was the illustrious person duction of force, but merely called who recently held that office deceafor inquiry, in which he thought him. sed, when, with the most extraordinary self entitled to the support of every haste, the vacancy was filled up. And friend to economy. Every feeling to whom was the situation given ? man who looked to the situation of The same messenger who carried to the country, and marked the aggrava- the country the account of the deted distress and misery which abound- cease of the late governor, took with ed in all quarters, must acknowledge him the appointment of the Earl of that it was high time for those who - Chatham, whose military glories might wished to see a different state of be summed up in the single fact, that things, to come forward, and call on he was commander of the memorable Parliament to act with vigour and expedition to Walcheren. On looking firmness. Whatever appearance the at the military establishment of 1787, difficulties of the country might as- a year corresponding with the presume—whatever shape they might put sent, he found that the whole army, 09-whether they were manifested in exclusive of India, amounted to 41,921 the decline of agriculture, of maru. men ; and now, in 1820, it comprised
92,224 men, being considerably more the east coast of Essex, for which he than double the force of the former could see no occasion, as 2000 seamen period; and the expense in the latter were sufficient to put down smuggling. time was still greater in proportion. In every cavalryregiment there might,
The total expenses for the army, ex- he conceived, be spared, 46 dismountclusive of extraordinaries, in the last ed men, and the second major ; this year, was 6,582,603l. ; for 1820, it would produce an annual saving, of was 6,807,5351.-an increase, as com- 80,000l. In the infantry, by dismisspared with the expenditure of lasting the second. majors, and forming year, of upwards of 200,0001. They the regiments into eight companies were also to recollect, that corps ré- instead of ten, a saving of 60 or 70,0001. duced in the last year occasioned a a-year might be made. The waggondiminution of expense to the amount train was of no earthly use. Every of 180,0001., which made the real in- man must be convinced of the abso. crease of this year, as compared with lute absurdity of keeping up such a the last, upwards of 400,000l. He body at present. During the war they would not, however, press any reduc. were employed to carry the sick, and tion, being aware that the general to assist the military in their movefeeling of the House was to consider ments. But now, when a regiment the increase as rendered necessary by scarcely removed once in a twelvethe state of the country. Yet he was month, they were evidently of no use. himself firmly convinced, that the By reducing this useless corps, the tranquillity of the country could be country would save 10,000l. a-year. preserved without the aid of a stand- The engineer corps was the most exing army. In no part of the empire pensive in the army, and though it had disaffection manifested itself by might be impolitic to part with the more alarming symptoms than in Scot- officers, who were men of education, land, yet the army there never amount- why not reduce the men ? The intried to more than 3000 men; and with cacy of the accounts in the recruiting that comparatively small regular force, department rendered a greater numaided by the inhabitants, who came ber of clerks necessary. The staff forward to defend their homes and appeared to him too numerous. There families, the peace of the country, were double the number of adjutantwith little exception, had been pre- generals in Ireland as in England; served. He wished the people in the and in the Leeward Islands there were South would act in the same manner. three general officers, while in JaIt was because the people in Scotland maica there was only one. The office had stood forward as yeomen and vo- of paymaster-general appeared to him lunteers, that peace and quietness useless. In the war-office, to which were maintained. He found that those henow requested attention, the charge who had come forward voluntarily in was 57,880l. In 1806, a deputy seScotland amounted tu 3700 men. If cretary and 112 clerks had been in the people of England would act as the war-office, and the expense had the inhabitants of Scotland had done, been 30,0001. Now, the number of they would soon put an end to all dis- clerks was increased from 112 to 147, turbance. The nineteen regiments of and the expenses were 48,0001. After cavalry now kept up, comprising touching on various minor points, he 11,000 men, appeared to him very came to the military college. It had superfluous. There were three regi- been reduced, but further reduction ments stationed at Hounslow, and on might yet be made. The senior de