of their exertions, the magnitude of their sacrifices, and the manner in which they were borne, gave a claim which no generous breast could resist, to suitable exer. tions-to a zeal, animation, and an ardour superior even to that of the people, to relieve them as much as possible from the burthens they have borne. When, therefore, such an enormous expense has been incurred for the support of troops on the continent, after the conclusion of the peace, it will be necessary, when the consideration of that expediency is entered upon, that not merely some speculation of possible good-though none whatever can, I believe, be adduced-but a necessity so pressing, a duty so imperious, should be made manifest to do that which we must suppose to have been most repugnant to the feelings-to prolong the exertions of the country, when that necessity seemed no longer to exist. Such necessity, I am persuaded, cannot be proved, and the expediency of the measure cannot be supported; but even to afford some palliation, it will be necessary to shew that some political advantages have been derived to this country. And if none have been derived, as I am confident is the case, it must be shewn that some advantages might, by possibility, have resulted from the employment of the troops in the quarters where they have been maintained. As to the more enlarged view to be taken of the measure, as affecting our general interests, if I had on Friday brought forward the present motion I should have offered some observations. But in the speech of the noble earl last night, among many things to disapprove, I heard with pleasure that the moment will soon arrive when the House might be informed of the result of the negociations carried on, from the entry of the allies into Paris to the moment when I am now speaking. Though this disclosure has been made, I cannot forbear remarking, that the engagement entered into on our part was, not to maintain our army as long as our own interests required it, but till the conclusion of the negociations to be carried on between other powers-a period over which we have no control, and depending on the conduct of powers which it was impossible for us to regulate-a period which if interpreted to the extent of the terms employed in the treaty would exceed in duration any time which might be mentioned to show the absurdity of that engagement. Such is the state of the engagements to which the security, augmenting our own prosperity, and alleviating the burthens of our people. But, my lords, though we have come to a close of the account as to the payment of money, the papers for which I am about to move will prove, that we have been maintaining in different parts of Europe, a larger army than in any former war Great Britain ever maintained; maintaining nearly twelve months after the close of the war a large force, the expense of which is thrown on the already-overburthened shoulders of the people. The question of the propriety of maintaining this force is not now to be argued; but the fact will soon be on the table of the House in a regular form, instead of being only known from some hint in some speech of some person, delivered at a time when perhaps there were hardly any hearers. The fact will now be before us-a fact certainly new and wholly unprecedented; and if it is to be justified at all, we must know the grounds on which it could be so justified. When this subject comes to be examined, and undoubtedly it will be examined, two distinct views must be taken of it, which though I shall not now enter upon, I think it fair to put the House in possession of the first is its effect on our financial system; the other, its effect on our political interests at home and abroad. As to the first point: when in the last year, by a most extraordinary turn of events the contest had been brought to a close, it was thought that not one moment would be lost to replace in their enjoyments of peace the people of the country, but more espe cially in those enjoyments to which there was the most pressing need that they should be restored. We had called on the people to support the war by exertions unknown to us before-by exertions which none but a free people could make. We knew the zeal and cheerfulness with which the people had submitted to their burthens, under the impression of the necessity of the contest in which we were engaged, and that whatever differences existed as to the manner in which the contest should be carried on, or whether greater or less efforts should be made in different parts, no dissentient voice for many years was heard as to the necessity of hazarding every thing-of making all sacrifices to maintain the contest. Though the people cheerfully submitted, they hoped that the exertions would be continued no longer than the necessity continued, and that parliament would feel that the very extent therlands. country has been subjected; but the opi- | the lowest point at which they could be nion of one of the King's ministers has proposed. He proposed to the committee been given as to the probable termination a detailed estimate of the peace establishof those engagements. That term, it is ment, at a time when we had no ally in said, will soon arrive; and when the result Europe, when even Holland was torn from of the negociations is laid before your us, and France was more flourishing in lordships, this one point must be discussed wealth and power than she now is-the either conjointly with the general ques- amount was less than five millions and a tion of those negociations, or separately, as half! After an experience of five years occasion may require; and I shall then he was inclined to believe that the first submit to your lordships the extreme im- estimate had reduced the establishments policy of employing British troops in the below their proper amount; and in the different parts where they have been same plain and intelligible mode in which maintained, and particularly in the Ne- he proposed the first establishment, he produced a detailed account on which an establishment of six millions only was founded. He did not rest there, but after seven years of peace, in 1792, when the manufactures and commerce of the country had begun again to be most flourishing, he proposed a reduction of 200,000l.; and your lordships will remember, that these different establishments were not in estimate merely, but that the supply of the year 1792 was actually less than six millions. I must beg your lordships to cast your eyes on the present situation of the country, and its situation in 1792, and imagine what any one who had taken part in the measures I have mentioned, must feel at hearing that any man could propose (for that it can be acquiesced in is impos The other motion it is still less necessary to explain. Whatever may be our policy as to the extent of the military establishment of the country, this is certain, that the House should know what efforts have been made, after ten or twelve months of peace, to reduce the expenditure of the country in that branch in which it most loudly calls for reduction-the different staff establishments maintained at home and abroad. The result I shall not anticipate. But if before this day I was anxious to know the result, my anxiety has been now increased to a degree which I can hardly describe. The necessity of a peace establishment, and of putting the military part of it down to the lowest level to which by any possibility it can be reduced, issible), that the peace establishment of obvious; and I am prepared to show on what grounds the army might be reduced in point of establishment, if not in point of expense, to the level in which it stood when the late unfortunate contest commenced. But now, from the reports which have been spread abroad, I learn that the question is not what the peace establishment shall be, but whether we ever shall have a peace establishment? I have been told that there was an individual capable of proposing, and an assembly of English gentlemen who had endured to hear of a peace establishment of 19 millions a year. A peace establishment of 19 millions a year! I have not had the opportunity of consulting official documents, from the short time since I have heard the report I have alluded to; but by a statement which I have seen, I have every reason to believe the report is correct. Do your lordships know what was the amount of the peace establishment at the close of the American war? The great and upright man who then was at the head of the finances of the country, felt it his duty to reduce the establishments to this country should be 19 millions a year! I see no reason for any considerable increase of the peace establishment beyond that of 1792. It is true there is a necessity of garrisoning two or three towns, which we had not then; but it can be proved that a necessity does not exist to provide any additional force, except for perhaps one of them. The others are of that nature, that the additional security they afford to other possessions will require no increase, but will authorize a diminution of force. I allude to the East Indies, where a considerable reduction of force will be required, which will cover any increase which may be made in other places. But though the force necessary be the same, I allow that for maintaining that force the expense must be greater. The pay of the troops has been increased; a boon in granting which I readily concurred, and which I would not consent to withdraw. On the pay of the officers an increase has been made, which I believe is absolutely necessary. It is not, therefore, possible to reduce the peace establishment exactly to the same sum at . which it was fixed in 1792; but the amount of force may be the same, or nearly the same, though the expense of maintaining that force may be varied by the circumstances of the times. I shall not pursue the details of the subject; but I thought it would not be consistent with my duty, if, after hearing such a report as has been spread abroad, I did not on the first meeting of your lordships call your attention to the dreadful purpose which is harboured of making this nation a great military power. We cannot disguise the fact. No one can have proposed a peace establishment of 19 millions but with the intention of changing the constitution of the country in such sort, that it shall no longer continue a free country-to make this nation rank among the great military nations of Europe. On this question probably your lordships will The Marquis of Lansdowne accepted the have session after session to decide; but pledge of the noble earl, that before they if that political establishment is effected, I were called on to accede to any proposhall cease to take a part in the business sitions for increasing the ordinary peace of this House, and to keep up the forms of establishment, the House should have a debate. For if a large military establish- complete opportunity of investigating the ment is permanently kept up-if this expense of the several departments. As nation becomes a military power-we the motion was not objected to, he should must of necessity cease to be a free, and, merely join with his noble friend in proconsequently, a happy people. His lord-testing against any event which might ship concluded by moving for, the statements mentioned in his speech. expensive, The expense entailed on the country was enormous; but the faith of the country was pledged to the arrangements on that subject, some of which, made by the administration of the noble lord (Grenville), were neither wise nor expedient. It was not to be supposed, however, that with all the colonies we were possessed of, the same military force as that of 1792, would be sufficient. Some military force was also necessary to secure internal tranquillity, and to maintain the character of the nation. The House would be much better qualified to judge on the subject after a full examination of the estimates that would be laid before them; though he admitted there was no subject on which the House should be more jealous, than that which respected the amount of our establishments in time of peace. The Earl of Liverpool, in reply, stated, that the subsidiary engagements with all the powers had terminated at the beginning of October last; with Austria, Prussia, and Spain, two months before: the subsidies having been limited to a time deemed sufficient to enable those powers to march their forces back to their respective countries, after the close of the war. As to the maintenance of troops in the Netherlands, the fact was admitted, and would be brought by the papers moved for, to which he had no objection, before the House. It was premature to enter then on the discussion of the subject; but he pledged himself to prove, not only that the arrangement was wise, but that it had actually been productive of beneficial consequences. As to the peace establishment, he should lay the fullest information before the House, and should court investigation on all branches, and take all measures to make them as little burthensome as possible. But it was to be considered that a great increase had taken place in the pay of all departments of the service, which would render an establishment on the same scale as that of 1792 much more tend to change the military system of the country. As the time would soon come for explaining the reasons for keeping up so large a force on the continent, it would be necessary to justify that measure, that it should be shown to have been done for British objects alone, and that the consequence would not be to involve the country in a connexion with the continent. If any change was to be effected in the military system of the country, he hoped the parliament would be called on to do it with its eyes open, and not be drawn incidentally or hurried by precipitation into change. The motions were agreed to. HOUSE OF COMMONS. STATE OF THE STREETS OF THE METROPOLIS Mr. M. A. Taylor rose to call the attention of the House to a public grievance, which, in his opinion, required both immediate remedy and future precaution. The only question, he apprehended, would be as to the nature of that remedy; for the evil of which he complained was indisputable and universally felt, yet without the interference of parliament would restraining them from taking up any pavement at their own pleasure, or from laying down any other than iron pipes in future, as well as to limit their right of breaking up a street to a particular period of the year. It was obvious that it was an evil chiefly experienced in the winter season. The inspector must be armed with the power of levying fines, either on the parish, or the authors of the mischief, and probably remain unredressed. He wished advertisements, and to appoint an into submit to the House the necessity that spector for each district, whose salaries, existed of preserving the pavements of with those of a few clerks, would constithe metropolis in such a state as should tute the whole expense of his measure. not endanger the safety of his Majesty's The salary of the inspector ought to be, subjects. Many accidents had already he conceived, not less than 500%. per anoccurred in consequence of the manner num, as he should be a person of uncorin which they were at present broken up; rupt character, and removable by the and not long since a coachman had been commissioners. It was his intention, if thrown from his box, and killed on the the House gave him leave to bring in the spot. He had been told, in the course of Bill, further to propose, that the Bill should his inquiries into the cause of this shame- become operative three months after its ful disorder and negligence, that it was passing into a law. It was a measure an evil which it was impossible to prevent. which could inflict no hardship on the This impossibility, however, he was de- parishes, whose duty it was already by termined to try, and would persevere at law to prevent all nuisances in the public the risk of giving offence to the parish streets. He should also introduce a comofficers, and even though the water com-pulsory clause on the water companies, panies should put him in their reservoirs, or the gas-light company into their furnaces. The city of London, he knew, was exempted by charter; but he trusted, that when they saw a proper system of inspection and control established in Westminster, they would think it worth their attention to imitate the example. With respect to the law as it already stood, there was no distinction between streets and highways, the former being so deno-in proportion to the extent of the evil, minated only from their running through subject to the revision of the commissioninhabited and populous places. They ers. He should also propose that these were indictable at quarter sessions, and it provisions might equally extend to the was the duty of the magistrates to assess gas-light companies, and the commisa sufficient rate, and direct the parochial sioners of sewers, and that they should all overseers to institute the proper repairs. be interdicted from laying down wooden The law, then, was entirely with him; pipes in future. He did not wish to inbut it was too dilatory in its application, terfere with the rivalship of different comand required the quickening energy of panies; no man was a greater enemy to parliament to give it its due and salutary monopoly than himself; his only object effect. The law guaranteed every man's was to secure to the public what they had title to the terra firma, and on him who a right to possess-a good, safe, and comobstructed or undermined it imposed the modious carriage-road. The fact was, obligation of fully and completely repair- the pavements, after being so opened, were ing the mischief he had occasioned. The not laid down again sometimes for months, streets of Paris were not subject to this and without some quick and compulsory inconvenience; and those of Edinburgh, measure, he was convinced the evil would and from that to Leith, were equally safe continue to exist. He was sorry he could and beautiful, forming an inclined plane, not compliment the right hon. the Chanand enabling carriages to proceed with cellor of the Exchequer, whom he then equal convenience and velocity. What saw in his place, on the condition of the he now proposed was, to bring in a Bill streets near the Treasury. From thence enabling the crown to appoint a board of to Scotland-yard their state was disgracecommissioners, and to divide the metro-ful as well as dangerous. On inquiring polis into four or five districts. These at the Treasury on this subject, he had commissioners were to act gratuitously, and to be composed of gentlemen resident in the particular district over which they presided, and to possess, as a qualification, 300l. a year, or 10,000l. in money. They were to be called on to publish proper been told that the cause was, there was no money there [a laugh]; but he trusted the right hon. gentleman would not support such an assertion. He should now move for leave to bring in a Bill for the purposes he had mentioned, and could $ assure the House that nothing would give | deducted, and 250,000l. would be the sum him greater satisfaction than the introduc- required. To purchase the ground netion of some measure better calculated cessary for altering the present office, in than that of which he had just submitted Lombard-street, would require 260,000l.; the outlines, to accomplish the object he so that, as the estimates were nearly equal, had in view-the improvement and ornament of the city ought to decide in favour of the new situation. 'si quid novisti rectius istis, Candidus imperti: si non, his utere mecum.' The hon. gentleman concluded with moving, "That leave be given to bring in a Bill for the better paving of the streets of the metropolis." Mr. Calvert inquired whether it was the hon. member's intention to include the borough of Southwark in the provisions of his Bill, as he conceived its streets rather deserved the eulogy passed on those of Edinburgh, than the censure on those in the neighbourhood of the Treasury. Mr. Taylor replied, that in a bill of this nature, it was impossible to except any particular district; but if Southwark required no inspection, it would become liable to no expense. The expense already borne by the metropolis was immense, not less than 150,000l. per annum, while that of his Bill would be no more than 2,3001. Leave was given to bring in the Bill. COURTS OF JUSTICE.] Sir John Newport rose to move for leave to bring in a Bill to impower the commissioners appointed to examine into the fees of the courts of justice, to compel the attendance of witnesses to be examined on that inquiry. He contended that such powers were necessary, particularly in a case like the present. It had been stated, on a former evening, that the officers of the courts could not refuse to give evidence before the commissioners; yet it was manifest that without such a bill as he proposed there was no compulsion on them to attend, while no persons were more likely to wish for concealment than those whose conduct was to be examined into. Besides, others must be examined, as er Leave was then given to prepare and parte statements would not be fully to be bring in the Bill. NEW POST-OFFICE.] Sir James Shaw moved for leave to bring in a Bill for improving the West end of Cheapside, St. Martin's-le-Grand, &c. and for providing a site in that part of the town for a New Post-office. relied on. It had been the constant prac tice to arm committees with powers to compel attendance, and he could see no reason why those powers should not be necessary on this as well as on any other occasion. As one instance, he would allude to the Carnatic commissioners, who were armed with such powers. The deMr. Grenfell declared, that the objections tails of his Bill would be liable to future formerly urged against the propriety of discussion; but to the principle of it, he changing the site of the Post-office, as did not see how there could be any obbeing attended with an expense of jection. He therefore moved, "That 800,000l. were founded on a misconcep- leave be given to bring in a Bill to tion of the amount required, either for the enable the commissioners appointed, or purpose of a removal, or of altering and to be appointed by royal commission, improving the present office, to render it to examine into the state of the courts adequate for the fulfilment of the duties of of justice of Great Britain and Irethat department. He had carefully cal- land, to compel the attendance of witculated the expenses of both, and foundnesses upon them, and their disclosure of them to be nearly equal. As the circumstance of expense was therefore removed, the point to be considered was, the increase of ornament and advantage the city would derive from the proposed change. The compensation for the property to be purchased in Cheapside, St. Martin's-leGrand, &c. he estimated at 150,000l.; the expenses of erecting the office would be 140,000l.; making an aggregate of 290,000l. From this let 40,000l. (the price of the materials of the present office) be all such matters respecting the same, as may be within their knowledge, and under such regulations as would be adopted in a court of law." Mr. Bathurst contended, that there was no occasion for such a Bill as was proposed by the right hon. baronet. The commissioners appointed in 1732 had acted without any such powers, and yet they went on in accomplishing the objects entrusted to them. The instance alluded to was very widely different from the present |